Side Order of CHIPS- Salt with a dash of vinegar

April 19, 2011 at 6:53 pm 16 comments

Part One – Political Pie with a side order of CHIPShttps://thatwoman.wordpress.com/2011/04/17/political-pie-with-a-side-order-of-chips/


For the past few years the organization CHIPS- The Coalition for Hispanic/Latino Issues and Progress has held forums introducing area candidates via tv and radio . They give the “opposing candidates” in any given race an opportunity to face off and answer pre determined questions.

Due to the crisis in my life the past three years I have not attended but I bit the bullet put on my emotional armour and attended last Wednesday’s forum at St. Josephs Community Center auditorium.

It was hot and I don’t mean the candidates – although the Mantini/ Higgenbotham slice of life was somewhat adversarial on Ms. Higginbotham’s side of the table 🙂
http://www.morningjournal.com/articles/2011/04/19/opinion/mj4415693.txt
No, it was the auditorium that was hot and even the ceiling started to sweat. There were times I admit I expected a “can I have an AMEN!!! to that” as the penchant for bringing “HIM” into the forum was evident –

In the States, virtually every political speech seems to mention God, especially in the final call “God bless America”. In Britain, no politician mentions God and none would think of inviting Him to show a special preference for his or her nation state.

ah American politics!!!!! 🙂


Of course no one wanted to bring into the mix the dread T word ( taxes) not me read my lips and yet for all the NO Tax talk by politicians through the years we are still paying them HMMMMMMM how can that be ? 😉

BUT the audience for the most part did as requested and remained quietly respectful for the sake of the TV and radio broadcasts.

Although at least one audience member was using the time to gamble on-line ( I just don’t know why he was there actually !)

So to the questions – I am leaving my platform of don’t criticize what your aren’t prepared to change” just a little bit here.

The questions I felt should be tailored to the individual candidates race. For instance I realize the SB5 is a top priority at the moment for a great many and is grabbing news but it is “fluid” the LPA’s and the annoying (to me at least) the THEM and US statistics –

NOTE
err as an aside to the “di- visionaries” we are all in this community together what effects one affects us all equally!) AND I am tired of the WHAT IF scenario I want theWHAT IS question dealt with!

For example in my -Ward 2- We have two people running Mr. Drwal
and Mr. Flores . Personally I would rather have the questions put them

” What is your major concern with the Ward and what solution do you see and how would you go about implementing the solution”

The Council at Large candidates– their wards comprise the whole of the city- Ward 2 or 6th is very much different from Ward 1/7 or 8 –

How would they deal with those issues that divide – Give an example of how you promote legislation that would benefit the city in total.


I don’t much care as to how they would deal with SB5 -others are dealing with that at a different level. I am sure none of the candidates for our Wards and in fact any of those attending “READ” the 400 pages of SB5.

We are lucky if some read their council packets SIGH
There were a couple of hiccups as least one senior moment in the Lorain Mayor’s table talk and in the Council at Large table talk only one of the candidates actually “answered the question as it was asked

All in all, in my opinion, there weren’t as many candidates on that stage as in previous years ( that could be due to “lack of opposition”) and the running of the event was a little less organized- but since I don’t care to get into the mix I will now shut up and thank CHIPS for the time and effort they put into these events.

You can view the Mayor of Lorain candidates table talk here

http://www.morningjournal.com/articles/2011/04/17/news/doc4da896ace81ba989260642.txt and catch Channel 20 the LCS (TWC) channel for the evening’s events

BUT DID THEY???????????????????

Schools questions The first part of the CHIPS evening was given to issues and Issue 9 was front and center. If I could have asked a question this is what I would have asked:

Would the failure of Issue 9 be the absolute death knell for LCS or can they revisit in November and would that be the ultimate ringing of the school bell?

What exactly would the state do should they come into Lorain?

How do you answer those that are planning on using Issue 9 to “send a message” that what the current LCS Admin and BOE are doing is “not good enough” from a community standpoint, because it is the community that ultimately decides?


If the levy does not pass either in May or November how many mils will “actually be lost”. ( I have been informed that in actual fact the LCS would lose 3.5 mils that there is a bottom line of 20 that has to be adhered to Is that accurate ?

How , does a Board of Education and an Administration make plans for the long-term when apparently the current Superintendent Dr. Atkinson is looking to leave?

How does a BOE work efficiently keep having to deal with the changing of horses in midstream/ personal loyalties/dislikes and searches getting in the way of decision-making etc when there is apparently even a lack of information sharing among themselves?

As a LCS superintendent and the BOE are overseeing Lorain 2nd largest employer and a product of that is of the utmost importance to our future how are you going to deal with the downward spiral-

or are we “morphing and evolving into a new era of charter schools”

which will eventually become the way education goes in this city- will that be the death knell for LCS?????


If Irving is the poster child
then you better start worrying LCS !!!!

Charter group to buy Lorain’s Irving School for $240K

NOTE I just hope my pie and chips hasn’t left you with indigestion but a burning desire in the pit of your stomach to do your homework ! As always answers to questions and differing opinions will have space on this blog

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Entry filed under: a Cow -elle opinion, Brit take, city of lorain, education. Tags: , , , .

Political Pie with a side order of CHIP(s) ISSUE TWO?????Is this for you???

16 Comments Add your own

  • 1. joe smith  |  April 19, 2011 at 7:44 pm

    Amen…Oops I mean right on!

    In a previous post you had mentioned the prayer before Lorain City Council meetings. Mr. Edwards and when he is absent Mr. Fallis both offer a very multi denominational statements asking that council members work to the best of there abilities for the good of ALL THE CITIZENS OF LORAIN. However each councilman ends the “prayer” with “…we ask this in Jesus’ name”.

    I wish City Council would stop the practice of invoking the name of Jesus at their public meetings. It doesn’t make sense and isn’t fair to any taxpayer/citizen who isn’t a Christian! Lorain is a multi cultural and multi denominational city. We celebrate our diversity every June with the International Festival.

    This may be a good question to ask at the General Election Forum in October.

  • 2. Loraine Ritchey  |  April 19, 2011 at 8:09 pm

    Again I think as in my posts re Bishop Lennon and how things are done just because there is a “majority of people with those beliefs they feel they can and that “might or majority thinking makes them right so they can do what they want ( after all who is going to complain not anyone who didn’t want to swim against the religious tide you would be pilloried…… –

    Separation of ” religion and state ( but it is the politicians that had included God in all things including government ( didn’t you lot ( meaning the pilgrims) try to leave that at one time back in the 1600’s 🙂 ) …but mind you some of the biggest miscreants in this city still go to church on Sunday SIGH…… ”

    I just think this is peculiar thinking to have these “prayers invoked” before a council meeting ( although some would say they need all the help they can get” 🙂

    Check out who wrote the original pledge of alligiance in 1892 quite a few years after the Revolutionary war
    http://oldtimeislands.org/pledge/pledge.htm

    and who added Under God you guessed it the
    “In 1951, the Knights of Columbus, the world’s largest Catholic fraternal service organization, also began including the words “under God” in the Pledge of Allegiance”
    not so much the divsion of church and state as some believe…….
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pledge_of_Allegiance
    I could go on an on….
    Separation I think not 😉

  • 3. Paula Tobias  |  April 19, 2011 at 10:04 pm

    I couldn’t agree more.

    I wondered if the low attendance was indicative of the apathy of the citizens of Lorain.

    The number of candidates on the agenda vs those that actually showed was indicative of? apathy? lack of relevance? lack of interest?
    lack of time? or the past history of this forum where favorites were played?

    I applaud the intent, voters need to be informed. And like council the body language and listening to the complete conversation is so important.

  • 4. thatwoman  |  April 19, 2011 at 11:30 pm

    Paula- ” favorites played ” Nah say it wasn’t so 😉 Now who would do that as if we didn’t know …. ah politics……….

  • 5. Anne Molnar  |  April 20, 2011 at 2:57 am

    This forum does play favorites. i sat down front to observe, and it does continue. i know first hand, it happened to me the very first time. I walked off stage and vowed never to return. Play me a fool once, and it will never happen again.

    As far as prayer. I believe that a moment of a silent prayer for any who wish to pray should be suffient with the Pledge following at the council meetings.

    Although sometime ago, I attended a council meeting in Seattle , Wash. and a short prayer was said with the pledge following.
    My own personal belief, I believe in the power of prayer which is done in my home and in church.

  • 6. Grammy  |  April 20, 2011 at 10:20 am

    The separation of church and state issue is really taken a turn for who knows what. It was originally meant that the government could not establish nor manage a “church/religion” for the country i.e. The Church of England. That is actually where the freedom of religion originiated, we are free to “practice” whatever form of religion we personally choose, not one chosen by our government. There is to be no religious persecution. All the arguments about separation are off the mark except for what WE have implied it to be.

    Thanks and have a great day!

  • 7. Grammy  |  April 20, 2011 at 10:24 am

    Apathy plays such a large part in politics not only in Lorain, but everywhere. If a politican would actually answer a question with a truthful answer, we would all be in shock. I see politics and campaigns rather as finger-pointing accusation conflict rather than telling the electorate what needs to be done and how to do it. They are more than happy to point out needs, solutions are be far few and far between. Even if they put forth a solution, it is usually lost in the “politics” and never sees light for the greater good.

  • 8. Loraine Ritchey  |  April 20, 2011 at 10:49 am

    Grammy I read up on the separation of church and state a while back and yes you are correct ( I linked to it in the previous article) funny isn’t it the government can’t manage the church but those of the religious persuasion are sure managing the government – no separation there 🙂 so a back handed difference ………

    hmmmmm the Church of England well the church was always there only the head of the Church of England was the Pope and Vatican ( England has always had a church 🙂 it was Henery and the herarchy of the church “in England” that took the power absolute from Rome in England ( and protested – protestant) and gave it to the King ( granted at the Kings wishes….) and it evolved from there . High Church of England last time I went at least was very very very similar to the Roman Catholic Church very little difference…..except our priest can be married of course but then at one time so could the RC the idea of Cof E in Henry’s time for married priests came from the Lutherans 🙂

    I am not saying people shouldn’t pray to whomever or whatever and wherever they like I am not here to belittle anyone’s beliefs – just as I wouldn’t dream of forcing my beliefs down anyone’s throat I would appreciate the same courtesy – unfortunately that doesn’t happen. ………..

  • 9. Grammy  |  April 20, 2011 at 7:32 pm

    So true, so true! I couldn’t agree with your religious stand more.

    Keep up the good work. Someone has to keep after the politicians in Lorain.

  • 10. Peter Potamus  |  April 21, 2011 at 1:10 am

    @anne_molnar

    Hello Anne,

    Referencing your “pledge of allegiance” support & coupling it with the conference of authority passed to you by the voters as a city council member…

    …i’d like to travel back in time to pre-WWII Germany where town/berg council memebers not unlike you were criticized for not being the last governmental (local) line of defense in STANDING UP AGAINST the higher levels of government (state & national) corrupted by the NAZIs…

    …history condemns those councilmen for waffling and sidestepping with the offering that “at least Herr Hitler keeps the trains running on time”…

    …Lorraine brought to her blog a tea party candidate who waxed about being an outsider who would bring something akin to populist values either to Columbus or Washington…

    …I mentioned to him about Richard Helms(CIA Director for LBJ and RMN) stating effectively that Israel murdered 34 US Sialors aboard the USS Liberty during the 1967 6-Day War… and he fled from this blog (presumably on one of the trains that Herr Hitler keeps running on time)…

    …Columbus & Washington don’t have the spine to stand up to the US Military-Industrial Complex who ordered Moshe Dayan to attack their own troops… CIA Director Colby stated everone of any significance in the Western News Media is wholly owned by the CIA…

    …that pretty much leaves the US town councils standing all alone… not unlike the German town councils of pre-WWII Germany, correct?

    4 NSA Directors have also come forward to clear their consciences before they die and have admitted the electronics & signals intelligence confirmed the attack was deliberate & not a mistake.

    Helms’s biography is currently available at LORAIN MAIN LIBRARY and all the Elyria Branches… page 300/301 contains the partial whitewash on the USS Liberty.

    Helms was told that the USS Liberty was only to be strafed and that only a few US Sailors would be killed… so was the 303 covert operations approval committee (Jimmy Carter Secretary of State, Cyrus Vance resigned from the 303 committee, one day after(6/9/67) the USS Liberty attack because he had been lied to).

    Thomas Skoch & Andrew Young don’t have the stones to even admit that their own newspapers turn a blind eye to tax fraud & insurance fraud by their paper route delivery drivers (no commercial insurance being carried)… the only thing those two can be counted on to do is to fold faster than cheap pieces of lawn furniture as they hypocritically criticize others in their editorials…

    ..it’s all up to the local town councils to stand up as the last line of defense… our military is killing its own citizens and its own soldiers to keep this war machine going, Anne…

    …the Barnes kid from Lorain and Michael Medders, Jr… they didn’t have to die…

    …had Julie Wallace not waffled with her brand of “the trains are running on time”, that Firelands grad would still be alive.

    …this duty falls at the extreme periphery of your duties as a councilman… what does the oath you swore obligate you all to do whne those with jurisdiction are the ones who are the murderers?

    We know what the German Town Councils did and how history now condemns them.

  • 11. Peter Potamus  |  April 21, 2011 at 1:17 am

    I mean it would be kind of a pathetic scene to see government meetings be prefaced by a bunch of spineless people praying & citing the pledge of allegiance (“with liberty & justice for all) only to bail out the instant it comes to fullfilling the pledge they just made & …..

    ……denying the provided guidance (it’s called a bible-trained “conscience”) from God that they had just prayed for, correct?

  • 12. Kalin  |  April 25, 2011 at 5:10 am

    Loraine, if I recall correctly from a case I’m working on, 10 mil is what can be enforced without a vote. Anything over that needs approval.

  • 13. Loraine Ritchey  |  April 25, 2011 at 11:46 am

    Thanks Kalin – I am so confused so bear with me and treat me as if I am a 4 year old in this.

    they can collect 10 mil without a vote? anything over that we have to vote upon? The 10 mil is automatic?

    Is there a minimum millage that is required for the schools

    For instance the public can’t (hypothetically ) vote no on taxes until we don’t pay any taxes that would go the schools. would that be an accurate statement ?

    and if in November ( if this renewal levy doesn’t pass in May) we vote no again and keep voting no on any new taxes or renewals what would be the minum millage the LCS would get? Thanks Loraine

  • 14. Kalin  |  April 25, 2011 at 6:27 pm

    I’m a bit surprised that the levy doesn’t read like this (BOLD TEXT IS MY ADDITION):

    A renewal of a tax for the benefit of the Lorain City School District for the purpose of current expenses and a levy of taxes to be made outside of the ten-mill imitation estimated by the county auditor to average 23.85 mills for each one dollar of valuation, which amounts to $2.385 for each one hundred dollars of valuation, for 5 years, commencing in 2011, first due in calendar year 2012.

    The way it is written now, the whole “effective millage” only being 12 mills is a mute argument because the issue doesn’t mention a total amount to be raised OR an average mills.

    I’ll try to tackle your questions.

    Q: they can collect 10 mil without a vote? anything over that we have to vote upon? The 10 mil is automatic?

    A: Correct. It’s much like a municipalities having the ability in Ohio to charge up to 1% city income tax without a vote

    Q: Is there a minimum millage that is required for the schools

    A: That would be a number for the school district to come up with. I don’t have any idea what the bare minimum cost would be in Lorain.

    Q: For instance the public can’t (hypothetically ) vote no on taxes until we don’t pay any taxes that would go the schools. would that be an accurate statement ?

    A: Correct. To get to zero, you could elect a school board that could make it zero.

    Q: and if in November ( if this renewal levy doesn’t pass in May) we vote no again and keep voting no on any new taxes or renewals what would be the minimum millage the LCS would get?

    A: There are so many variables, but I think the ultimate answer is 10 mills. If a fiscal takeover is similar to how the state would take over a city, all contacts would be cancelled and a tax would be levied without our consent. Since LCS can not operate in a deficit, it might be different.

    (I have given answers to the best of my knowledge)

    What most people would be interested in knowing is that using property taxes to fund schools has been found UNCONSTITUTIONAL by the Ohio Supreme Court twice in recent years. Here’s a link that sheds some light on that: http://www.schoolfunding.info/states/oh/12-11-02DeRolphIV.php3

  • 15. Kalin  |  April 25, 2011 at 6:28 pm

    Duh, I forgot to add the tag to end the bold text !!! It’s supposed to go after “and a levy of taxes to be made outside of the ten-mill imitation estimated by the county auditor to average”

  • 16. Loraine Ritchey  |  April 25, 2011 at 6:41 pm

    thanks Kalin will correct that for you and again thanks for the info……..

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